Simulation in SoD2

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by SomeRandomGuy, Jan 29, 2018.

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  1. SomeRandomGuy

    SomeRandomGuy Famous

    So it's been said that it won't be present in SoD2, and apparently there are a lot of people upset about this. Personally I'm glad it's not going to be around as I was getting rather tired of people going missing and then dying in the same simulation, it got to the point where I felt it necessary to make a backup save every time I log off to avoid it.

    But why wasn't it just made an option that's off by default so people who like it can turn it on, and people who don't like it could just leave it disabled? Seems like that would have been the best of both worlds.
    xGbHx, Morak and Vanilla like this.
  2. Vanilla

    Vanilla Here To Help

    I'm just thinking that a simple on/off option would not be possible for a complex in-game system.
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  3. QMJS

    QMJS Famous

    Yeah, it would be much more complicated. It would have to turn off whatever system they have replaced it with, and turn on the old system. Both sets of code would have to be integrated into all of the other systems, so you would essentially have two separate systems each for facilities, characters, fatecards (random events) , healing, resource usage, and so on. It would basically be two separate games trying to exist inside one.

    I suspect that people who have played with the original system are going to end up wishing it was back.
    SwissArmyKnife likes this.
  4. SomeRandomGuy

    SomeRandomGuy Famous

    I might have missed something, but from the interviews and such it sounded like the whole fatecard and offline progression system was thrown out for SoD2 because they wanted to focus on players having consequences for their actions and not so much being wrecked by RNG even if you do everything right.
    Rooney likes this.
  5. Furie

    Furie Here To Help

    Just to clarify, the simulation is still a part of the game. It's the offline progression that's been removed. This was one of the touted features of the original game and a massive selling point, but unfortunately there were a few things the implementation didn't take into account.

    The facilities you set in motion progressed while you were offline, and abilities you'd used cooled down while you were offline. This left the player being rewarded for not playing the game, while those who kept playing had a harder time of it. Then there was the way it kept your current status going. If you went offline and things were good, you'd come back to lots of items found. Leave things a bit chaotic, and you might come home to missing or dead survivors. This meant that a bad run would keep punishing you when you were offline, unless sorted things before saving and exiting. As life happens and means we all have different times to play in, someone might come on, have a bad mission, go off, come back on to more hell having gone down and be caught in a cycle due to one short play session. While adding consequence to actions, it went too far by ignoring the fairness that must be inherent in game design. In short, if your guys're dying, it should never be out of your hands simply because you didn't play long enough.

    A decision was made to scrap the feature as a result and it was toned down majorly in the first game to a point where it was almost non-existent. In this new game it isn't there, even as an option, because it simply didn't work like they wanted it to. As the guys above have said, this will be replaced by another system for progression and rewards in the new game and rebalancing that so that it can work in tandem with the offline simulation is a shit ton of work just to accommodate an optional system that barely anyone liked the first time around.
    DeadK9Handler, Rooney and Fabian907 like this.
  6. QMJS

    QMJS Famous

    The point is though, that the offline reset simulation did exactly that... it rewarded players for making sure that their base was prepared and people were happy. If they left the game with the base in a bad state, bad things would happen.

    All of the facilities and cooldowns occurred on a time system, not due to the simulation. It was simply that some were quite long, but if you continued playing, they would complete on the schedule as show by the timers in the journal.

    But, the offline part is what was removed, not the effects themselves. You will still need resources, but they will be used up periodically instead of only at the offline daily reset. So, if you are low on ammo or materials, you no longer just have to make sure to get some before logging off... you will have to get them immediately, because the consequences won't be held off until the reset. They will show up as soon as you are low. When a character runs away, you won't have the option to make sure you get them sometime before logging off... they'll have a timer, and if you don't get to them before the timer runs out, they will be gone. Those timers may pause when logged off.. or they may not. No information about it yet.

    As far as what I have seen (and some is speculation because there has been no real substantial news about any of these)... it removes the ability to prepare for the next day by taking care of the needed tasks before you log off. Those tasks must be addressed immediately.
    SwissArmyKnife likes this.
  7. SomeRandomGuy

    SomeRandomGuy Famous

    If that's really how it's going to work that's a good change, as nice as it was loading up the game and seeing messages about people having collected resources I won't miss events happening while I'm not around. I can deal with building timers and such being paused when I shut the game off but finding people dead or having left because things weren't perfect when I last played also won't be missed.

    But you're saying the fatecard events are still going to be present? That seems counterintuitive to wanting anything bad happen because of player choices, things like having your construction mats drained because of several "wall repair" events in a row are not fun.
  8. QMJS

    QMJS Famous

    Yeah, fatecard events are not part of the simulation, they are ongoing during play based on timers. They never mentioned removing any of those sorts of things, only the offline simulation. Don't have any real information to work from, but there are a few actual fatecard events that do happen during the simulation period, all of which are beneficial, like the extra resources that scavengers bring in, so we don't know if those are just eliminated or rewritten in some other method.

    They also haven't mentioned how the extra stuff you get during the reset is going to work, like the free items produced when you have specific facilities.
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2018
  9. QMJS

    QMJS Famous

    Because they have only mentioned removing the offline simulation, this is what to expect. These things will have to be modifed to happen in some other way, or not at all.
    The actual offline simulation in State of Decay does these things:

    First, it removes the resources used. If there are enough materials, resources from outposts are added. If offline long enough for a second reset to occur, add the bonus resources.

    Then, it runs though a list and does these:

    1. Gives free medicines based on infirmary type and medicine confidence (amount of medicine resource stored.)
    2. Gives free snacks and coffee based on food confidence.
    3. Gives free bullets based on ammunition resource confidence.
    4. Gives free Molotov's based on fuel resource confidence.
    5. Gives free fougasses based on fuel resource confidence if you have completed the research.
    6. Gives free stimulants based on infirmary type and medicine resource confidence if you have completed the research.
    7. Gives free suppressors based on workshop type and materials resource confidence, with different types based on research.
    8. Repairs guns in the locker.
    9. Repairs melee weapons in the locker.
    10. Repairs cars in parking spaces based on workshop type.
    11. Checks for up to 6 characters with 'Ran Away' status that are now at base and gives them a 50% chance of changing to a different mood.
    12. Checks up to 6 sick and 6 injured characters and checks to see if they heal or get worse.
    13. Checks up to 12 characters with hunger/starvation and allows them to recover if there is enough food.
    14. Checks up to 12 characters with sleep deprivation and allows them to recover if there are sufficient beds.
    15. Prints out death summary notices for anyone who died the previous day (Not during the simulation).
    16. Prints out other summary notices that apply from the previous day (recovery from illness, counseling success, abandonment, etc.)
    17. Prints out summary notices from new effects (sleep deprivation, hunger, outpost failure from lack of materials)
    18. Resets the summary counters used for #15 and 16
    19. Sets time played and days offline to 0.

    A separate event then checks to see if there are up to 5 people with the fled status who are still missing, and they die. (Technically not part of the reset, but since it does happen at the same time it probably could be considered a part of it.)

    For the fatecards that apply during the reset, there is one that discovers new nearby infestations.

    Then the Daily_offline adds the resources brought back by scavengers.

    In the story mode, it does things slightly differently:

    Enclaves may collapse, but that is not part of the reset system, but is another timer based system.

    The free items placed in the locker are the same, but up to 12 individual characters are given pills, snacks, and ammunition that matches their equipped gun directly into thier inventory. (Allowing ammo farming for wanted types by making sure everyone is using a gun of that caliber.)

    Characters who are missing MAY die. They have a chance of surviving.

    So, overall, the majority of the events of the reset are beneficial. The three that may be drawbacks are running out of resources that you didn't make sure you had enough of, characters that were missing that you didn't recover may die, and sick or injured characters may get worse (but may also recover.)
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2018
    SwissArmyKnife likes this.
  10. DicheBach

    DicheBach Got Your Back

    I LIKE the idea of the game punishing players for failing to properly prepare and organize, and rewarding players for the opposite.

    What is whacky about the "offline simulation" part is linking this to player behavior outside of the game. Oh, you need to logoff now despite only just getting your new base setup? Don't really have time to spend another hour or two getting everything fully setup? Well too bad, you're going to be punished because if you logout, the game will treat that as a "time passage" point.

    A better design would have been: the player controls when "time passage" points occur in game but is constrained by certain limitations that force them to happen with some periodicity. As I explained in this post on the Alamo forums:
  11. QMJS

    QMJS Famous

    It is a rolling 14 hour system. When you log in and a reset occurs, it will not happen again until 14 hours have passed, no matter how often you log on or off. So, in most cases where you may need to log off earlier than expected, you still will have a considerable time where you can log in again and correct things before the reset. If you are logged in when it hits that 14 hour point, it doesn't take effect until you log out and back in.
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